Organizing/ structuring rule sets and rules

[tamorgen]

Good evening all,
I've run across a quirk with my iBlinds motors in Home Assistant. Each iBlinds zwave motor has two controls that I can use. One is a switch, and one is a cover control.

cid:A1190F3F-FB02-4332-93DE-9A15A490D9AB

The switch control is a binary on/off switch. On, the blind goes to the "open" position (v2 controllers, 50%, v3 controllers user definable parameter)

If you click on the cover icon, it moves between two positions. Essentially, it's closed in both positions, just 180 degrees apart. The cover control does give you the granularity to move to any position between 0 and 100, which is sometimes useful, when you just don't want it open or closed, such as letting some light in, but closing it enough when the sun is shining directly into the window and blinding everyone.

Here's the problem, which I've brought up with iBlinds support, and they're singing Simon and Garfunkel (Sound of Silence). The two controls don't update each other. If I open or close using the switch, the cover position value doesn't change. If I open or close using the cover control, the switch doesn't change to on or off. I've verified that this isn't just an issue with the dashboard/templates I'm using by going into the developer tools on HA and the values do not change. I've also checked those values in Reactor (Entities tab) and they do not update properly.

I've come up with a Reactor work around which sort of forces the controls to update. If anyone knows of a better way, please tell me. I have two rules set up that monitor for changes in the switch state, that then performs a x_haas_cover.set_cover_position to either 0 or 50 for either to off or to on respectively.

This is sort of a one way street at the moment. I don't have a reverse rule set up to change the switch value, but the current rule seems more of an issue.

All that being said. I have 14 iBlinds motors in my home. That would mean 28 rules in Reactor. I know how to set up a Dynamic Group Control for Triggers. I put all 14 switches in the reactor.yaml file, and I can use those for triggers. How would I go about using 14 corresponding cover controls for the reactions?

It may be a simple matter, but I'm not sure. One thing i can say is the name of the switch and cover entities are the same, except for the control type:

Edit:

Running:
Reactor: latest-23078-d592d400
Home Assistant 2023.3.5
Supervisor 2023.03.3
Operating System 9.5
Frontend 20230309.1 - latest

[gwp1]

@tamorgen So iBlinds are a funny beast. I'm running 11 of the v3's and my automations run the gamut from normal open/close to "tilt when the sun hits this side of the house", "tilt when I'm not home (for privacy)" - smashing the sun tilt together with the Away tilt... oh boy is that fun.

I use a Zooz ZWave stick connected to Home Assistant to run them. They're happy together but I also do run a ping rule hourly lest they lose sight of the stick. Hubitat runs the rest of the house for now.

To control them... oy. Here's a couple samples:

The .refresh keeps Home Assistant happy in keeping the two status' you have in your first screenshot in sync.

I have fought long and hard over the past two years with many, many hours of trial and error with these and, even this morning, am still making adjustments. I am quite demanding of my automations with them, in all fairness to both the blinds themselves and MSR.

ProTip: if you're controlling multiple iBlinds in one automation, a five or so second delay between each blind's actions will help a LOT. I believe I actually got that advice from iBlinds Support (when they answer).

Yes - you will have a LOT of iBlinds rules and reactions to truly control these bad boys. No - you will never get them all to open/close simultaneously. I've settled on a nice routine where they start their actions at the front of the house and end at the back, each performing it's task sequentially after the other. Not quite as cool but it's still ok.

OH - I also do a weekly recalibration to keep the iBlinds "accurate" lest they drift a bit over time.

To your actual ask - I've installed the Dynamic Group Controller but not delved into it as yet. Hopefully the info above helps you as the iBlinds rabbithole can run deep and dark. MSR has been key in my ability to get the iBlinds to function the best of any integration I've tried.

[toggledbits]

Note that @gwp1 is using ZWaveJSController to interface with iBlinds, not HassController. So this is more direct control that circumvents HA's interpretation.

[gwp1]

@gwp1 Yes, forgot that part, thank you @toggledbits.

[tamorgen]

@gwp1 said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

@tamorgen So iBlinds are a funny beast. I'm running 11 of the v3's and my automations run the gamut from normal open/close to "tilt when the sun hits this side of the house", "tilt when I'm not home (for privacy)" - smashing the sun tilt together with the Away tilt... oh boy is that fun.

I use a Zooz ZWave stick connected to Home Assistant to run them. They're happy together but I also do run a ping rule hourly lest they lose sight of the stick. Hubitat runs the rest of the house for now.

To control them... oy. Here's a couple samples:

The .refresh keeps Home Assistant happy in keeping the two status' you have in your first screenshot in sync.

I have fought long and hard over the past two years with many, many hours of trial and error with these and, even this morning, am still making adjustments. I am quite demanding of my automations with them, in all fairness to both the blinds themselves and MSR.

ProTip: if you're controlling multiple iBlinds in one automation, a five or so second delay between each blind's actions will help a LOT. I believe I actually got that advice from iBlinds Support (when they answer).

Yes - you will have a LOT of iBlinds rules and reactions to truly control these bad boys. No - you will never get them all to open/close simultaneously. I've settled on a nice routine where they start their actions at the front of the house and end at the back, each performing it's task sequentially after the other. Not quite as cool but it's still ok.

OH - I also do a weekly recalibration to keep the iBlinds "accurate" lest they drift a bit over time.

To your actual ask - I've installed the Dynamic Group Controller but not delved into it as yet. Hopefully the info above helps you as the iBlinds rabbithole can run deep and dark. MSR has been key in my ability to get the iBlinds to function the best of any integration I've tried.

I've been running 14 iBlinds v2 since 2019, and I just replaced 2 of them with v3.1. I've always had issues with the units responding consistently. The answers I've gotten from their support is "try repairing it closer", or you need to have beaming repeaters. I have 75 Z-wave devices in my house, and every single device that is hard wired is beaming. I think they just have a script that assumes it's the users fault, and they really aren't interested in helping.

I could set up a ping hourly, and that may help with connectivity. I don't run them all at once. I have Reactor set to "wait for completion" on each of the reactions before moving on to the next one.

None of this unfortunately addresses the issue of the switch control and the cover control not being in sync. I don't seem to have a .refresh command in HA, or at least I'm not sure where it is. If that syncs them up, then I'll be happy. Where is that refresh command located?

[tamorgen]

@gwp1 said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

@tamorgen That sounds vaguely familiar!

Low and behold iBlinds support finally got back with me, and they actually acknowledged the original problem I was seeing was actually a problem.

Hi Timothy,

Very sorry for the delayed response, we have been getting more reports of this issue and have been building up to a solution. We have determined this to be a driver issue within Home Assistant that will need to be addressed for each hub. 
We have never really sent battery report until battery level drops to the low battery alert threshold and this feature is required by zwave certification.  We always had the hub poll the battery level since some hubs opted for polling the device independently of the device sending a report. ​We will need to add polling to the HA driver and other drivers of the same issue. 

Thank you for your patience.

Thanks,
Chance H.
The iBlinds Team

and

Hi Timothy,

To add to this, the polling will update the position as well as the battery to address your issue specifically.

Thanks,
Chance H.
The iBlinds Team

Feeling some vindication, after their original emails were all to the tone of "you're doing it wrong, you need to exclude and pair your devices. You need beaming repeaters (I guess the 55 other devices that aren't battery powered and are beaming don't count)."

[toggledbits]

I've split this topic. This thread remains for discussion specific to iBlinds only; if you have further comments on your issue getting ZWaveJSController running, please make those in the new thread where that specific discussion takes place.

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

I've split this topic. This thread remains for discussion specific to iBlinds only; if you have further comments on your issue getting ZWaveJSController running, please make those in the new thread where that specific discussion takes place.

Thanks Patrick, that's fine. I knew it was going off on a bit of a tangent and asked you to fork it a bit ago.

Back to the original subject, now that I'm have ZWaveJSController working and I can use the refresh command, I still want to set up a rule based upon a state changing to poll the entity and force that refresh.

I set up the Dynamic Groups in my reactor.yaml using the zwavejs entities. I have three ones set up. One for the switch state, one for the position state, and one for the cover state. This way, I can run refresh if anyone of them changes. If there is a better way, please let me know.

        "iblinds_switch":
          select:
            - include_entity:
              - 'zwavejs>63-0'
              - 'zwavejs>62-0'
              - 'zwavejs>64-0'
              - 'zwavejs>65-0'
              - 'zwavejs>79-0'
              - 'zwavejs>77-0'
              - 'zwavejs>78-0'
              - 'zwavejs>206-0'
              - 'zwavejs>205-0'
              - 'zwavejs>75-0'
              - 'zwavejs>74-0'
              - 'zwavejs>71-0'
              - 'zwavejs>16-0'
              - 'zwavejs>61-0'
          filter_expression: >
            entity.power_switch.state

        "iblinds_position":
          select:
            - include_entity:
              - 'zwavejs>63-0'
              - 'zwavejs>62-0'
              - 'zwavejs>64-0'
              - 'zwavejs>65-0'
              - 'zwavejs>79-0'
              - 'zwavejs>77-0'
              - 'zwavejs>78-0'
              - 'zwavejs>206-0'
              - 'zwavejs>205-0'
              - 'zwavejs>75-0'
              - 'zwavejs>74-0'
              - 'zwavejs>71-0'
              - 'zwavejs>16-0'
              - 'zwavejs>61-0'
          filter_expression: >
            entity.cover.position.value


        "iblinds_cover":
          select:
            - include_entity:
              - 'zwavejs>63-0'
              - 'zwavejs>62-0'
              - 'zwavejs>64-0'
              - 'zwavejs>65-0'
              - 'zwavejs>79-0'
              - 'zwavejs>77-0'
              - 'zwavejs>78-0'
              - 'zwavejs>206-0'
              - 'zwavejs>205-0'
              - 'zwavejs>75-0'
              - 'zwavejs>74-0'
              - 'zwavejs>71-0'
              - 'zwavejs>16-0'
              - 'zwavejs>61-0'
          filter_expression: >
            entity.cover.state

The rule I'm trying to set up is to look for any change on those switches (on to off or off to on), and then set a reaction to refresh the cover (zwave_device.refresh)

In the set reaction, it doesn't appear to let my dig down any further once I put the group in. What do I need to do to make this work, if it's even possible.

[toggledbits]

@tamorgen said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

In the set reaction, it doesn't appear to let my dig down any further once I put the group in. What do I need to do to make this work, if it's even possible.

Experimental, undocumented feature: add group_actions: true to your group's configuration:

    "iblinds_switch":
      select:
        - include_entity:
          - 'zwavejs>63-0'
            ...
          - 'zwavejs>61-0'
      filter_expression: "entity.power_switch.state"
      group_actions: true

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

@tamorgen said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

In the set reaction, it doesn't appear to let my dig down any further once I put the group in. What do I need to do to make this work, if it's even possible.

Experimental, undocumented feature: add group_actions: true to your group's configuration:

    "iblinds_switch":
      select:
        - include_entity:
          - 'zwavejs>63-0'
            ...
          - 'zwavejs>61-0'
      filter_expression: "entity.power_switch.state"
      group_actions: true

Thanks Patrick. I'll give that a try.

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

@tamorgen said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

In the set reaction, it doesn't appear to let my dig down any further once I put the group in. What do I need to do to make this work, if it's even possible.

Experimental, undocumented feature: add group_actions: true to your group's configuration:

    "iblinds_switch":
      select:
        - include_entity:
          - 'zwavejs>63-0'
            ...
          - 'zwavejs>61-0'
      filter_expression: "entity.power_switch.state"
      group_actions: true

You said it was unsupported

Reactor doesn't seem to like my filter.

[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:19:59.724Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>63-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]

These are the values when I look at the Entities tab for one of the blind controllers.

[toggledbits]

Well that has nothing to do with group actions. It's specifically complaining about your filter. Hass is famous for giving null state when a device is unreachable or still initializing. If the DGC comes up faster than Hass, you get those messages. They usually don't stick.

And please remember the posting guidelines. When posting an error, don't just post the error message; you need to post several dozen lines from before it, for context.

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

Well that has nothing to do with group actions. It's specifically complaining about your filter. Hass is famous for giving null state when a device is unreachable or still initializing. If the DGC comes up faster than Hass, you get those messages. They usually don't stick.

And please remember the posting guidelines. When posting an error, don't just post the error message; you need to post several dozen lines from before it, for context.

Understood, however, the system has been back up for white a while, and it just keeps repeating those errors. The lines I'm seeing before are unrelated and appear to be just normal reactions in my system.

[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.461Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>63-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>62-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>64-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>65-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>79-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>77-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>78-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.462Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Cover#zwavejs>206-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Cover#zwavejs>205-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>75-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>74-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>71-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>16-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T18:44:11.463Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.cover.state error with Light#zwavejs>61-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits

I restarted Reactor to see if I could see anything coming back up.

latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:05.925Z <Structure:INFO> Structure#1 stopping DynamicGroupController#groups
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:05.926Z <DynamicGroupController:null> DynamicGroupController#groups stopping
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:05.926Z <Controller:NOTICE> DynamicGroupController#groups stopping
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:05.927Z <Controller:ERR> Controller DynamicGroupController#groups is off-line!
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:09.706Z <Structure:INFO> Structure#1 loading controller interface groups (DynamicGroupController)
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:09.710Z <DynamicGroupController:null> Module DynamicGroupController v22313
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:09.746Z <Structure:INFO> Starting controller DynamicGroupController#groups
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:09.750Z <Controller:NOTICE> Controller DynamicGroupController#groups is now online.
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.711Z <DynamicGroupController:INFO> All controllers ready, setting up dynamic groups
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.728Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>63-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.728Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>62-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.728Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>64-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.728Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>65-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.728Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>79-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.729Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>77-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.729Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Light#zwavejs>78-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.729Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Cover#zwavejs>206-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]
[latest-23078]2023-04-03T19:06:14.729Z <DynamicGroupController:ERR> DynamicGroupController#groups filter expression entity.power_switch.state error with Cover#zwavejs>205-0: [ReferenceError] Invalid scope in reference to member state of (object)null [-]

[toggledbits]

OK. Two things:

1. When I made the example for group_actions above, I abbreviated the select and filter expressions, which I didn't expect you to copy verbatim; I just put it there for alignment/indenting. Use the select and filter expressions you had previously.

2. Update to the 23093 version of ZWaveJSController I just released, which fixes another small iBlinds issue.

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits said in Can I use Dynamic Group Control for Triggers and Reactions?:

OK. Two things:

1. When I made the example for group_actions above, I abbreviated the select and filter expressions, which I didn't expect you to copy verbatim; I just put it there for alignment/indenting. Use the select and filter expressions you had previously.

2. Update to the 23093 version of ZWaveJSController I just released, which fixes another small iBlinds issue.

Thanks. I thought the filter expressions format had changed for with the group_actions flag, so I changed it to your example.

I also updated to the latest ZWaveJSController.

I still eppar to be getting those same errors, even with changing back to:

    "iblinds_switch":
                select:
                  - include_entity:
                    - 'zwavejs>63-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>62-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>64-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>65-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>79-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>77-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>78-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>206-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>205-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>75-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>74-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>71-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>16-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>61-0'
                filter_expression: >
                  entity.power_switch.state
                group_actions: true
              "iblinds_position":
                select:
                  - include_entity:
                    - 'zwavejs>63-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>62-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>64-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>65-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>79-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>77-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>78-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>206-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>205-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>75-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>74-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>71-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>16-0'
                    - 'zwavejs>61-0'
                filter_expression: >
                  entity.cover.position.value
                group_actions: true

[toggledbits]

entity.attributes.power_switch.state and the same change for the others, like you had originally.

[tamorgen]

@toggledbits
Thanks, that did the trick. Do I need to use the local expressions when using this approach? I'm guessing no.

[toggledbits]

That would depend on what you're using them for. The only one I see above is to make a list of entity names from a group's members, presumably to use it in a message or something else not yet completed?